Mon Palae
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Posted - 2004.03.22 10:05:00 -
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Edited by: Mon Palae on 22/03/2004 10:09:40
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You compare the missiles with "large" turrets, but which ships can use large turrets. Yes only BS can use large turrets. CM or torps are usable by cruiser and frigs which could not mount large guns.
I think this is the rub. Frigs with turrets can't do near the damage per gun as a cruiser or battleship. But a missile is a missile. While missiles mya be overall weak compared to turreted weapons on battleships they are hugely more powerful when put on a frigate. There is a reason a Kestrel is one of the very few frigates considered dangerous in PvP (assuming you have more than one of them but then no single frigate is a serious threat to a battleship).
Of course people complained bitterly at suggestions that frigs not be able to use cruise as those were about the only weapon that gave any life at all to frigs in fleet combat.
If you up the power on missiles you up the power of frigates like the Kestrel making then inordinately powerful.
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For most guns you need cap, for missile you dont need cap. The range of cm or torp is much greater than for turrets with the best ammo. Without some disadvanteges on using missiles, they would be the best weapon in game and this would suck. No you can combine weapons, but if lunchers are uber, why should i do combine any more? Yes you can counter them with Medium Smartbombs (CM) and with large SB the torp, but at which costs. Capcost yes. And with 0 Cap you are dead meat.
Lots more ways to counter missiles than just sbombs. Outrun/outmaneuver them if you can. Defender missiles (although granted those need serious help). Shoot them with turrets (you can have a cruiser in a fleet for this purpose and it can be fairly effective). Add to that supposed anti-missile cruisers as part of the line-up for T-II cruisers. Every other wepon is instahit. Beyond trying to beat a turret's tracking speed (which seems not entirely as cut-and-dried as it should be) you have no defense against them inasmuch as you can avoid damage entirely like you can with a missile.
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You need a lot of skills and a BS to use large Guns, which are better than luncher. And you need only few skills, to use luncher and small ships probably cruiser.
This goes with the earlier point of missiles being usable on all ships unlike using BS weapons on a frig (for example). The last patch saw the skills needed to use missiles get increased. Whether that is enough is open to debate but clearly CCP is walking down that path. That said drones are the flip-side to missiles and they need SERIOUS work as mentioned earlier. A Rax unloading 8 Ogres on anything is going to give that ship a very bad time. Harder for the Rax to get in that position but worse than missiles if it does.
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Most pirate-alts have only learned to fly a kestrel and are capable to use cm. Why you think they havent learned large guns and a BS skill. Yes because you need time for it. And they dont miss. Never, only if you outrun them, or if you hide behind something. Turret still have several misses, so the DOT on missiles are still better, for the cost of isk.
Missiles DO miss all the time. They just generally come back around and try again. This may or may not mean anything to you depending on circumstances. Kestrel Rapes are usually done against haulers and it is a crappy tactic but yes...a hauler is not going to avoid a missile attack. What's more they are lucky to fit a single micro-smartbomb and that is very hard to time right to stop a missile. When 8 are in-bound from a dual Kestrel attack combined with an sbombs long recharge time the hauler is pretty much dead meat. Then again a hauler is dead meat from battleships too. Kestrel Rapes only happen because people are willing to throw them away in order to get the goodies which they would not do as easily in a battleship.
DoT in missiles IS less than battleship weapons. Period. Even including misses. Turrets may miss on occasion but then again they do wrecking hits on occasion. Most players know on balance what their turrets to damage wise and for battleship turrets it is flat out more than missiles by a good margin (DoT here if not outright one hit damage...which they often win at anyway as well). For cruisers I'd say it is close. If all missiles hit then they outdamage turrets. If the missiles are defended against it is a gray area. I have little trouble against missiles from ships with 1-2 launchers, three starts to hurt, more I worry. For frigs missiles (cruise...maybe heavies) are better.
Missiles are all about saturation. Missile spam and it will start to hurt, eventually, the other guy but it needs to be a serious overload.
And of course missiles are hideously expensive. At least they decreased their build time which previously was absurd.
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